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On Tradition & Culture
M3

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       Many thanks to
                 SHADOWgraphix
                 for the Š animated
                     djembe player.

Thu Oct 3 20:39:39 1996
From: CaiMaelNia@aol.com
Subject: Thoughts on Tradition/Innovation

Hi,
During Mamady's class in Boston he explained that the playing of a kenkine and a sangban one stacked on top of the other by one drummer was not in keeping with tradition. He also said that at times one must be innovative when adapting to the modern world or a given situation, i.e.... The promoter of a tour says he does not have the dollars to pay three drummers only two, so to allow the contract to go forward a single drummer adapts and plays the parts for two. His point was you must decide what your purpose and reason for playing is at any given time. If you are playing in a manner to respect the tradition, then adhere to the traditional methods and teachings. If your intention is to be innovative then be clear that you are diverging from tradition and proceed with that knowledge.

I agree that there must be a place for both tradition and innovation, this creates the circle which is quite possibly the oldest tradition of all.

Fri Oct 4, 1996 12:11:58
From: drum1@pacificnet.net (Paulo Mattioli)
Subject: Re: Tradition v. Ballet, etc.

>
>>I have never been to any of Mamady's workshops, but from my experience most of the rhythms taught in workshops are rhythms played by the national ballet ensembles. These rhythms are very often NOT traditional. Because of the demand for material, each ensemble use choreographers that put together dances based on the tradition. The drummers then come up with rhythms that fits the dance. Although these rhythms are based on tradition, they are NOT traditional.>>

>Actually, Mamady mentions this topic in his workshops and makes it perfectly clear that there is a difference between traditional and ballet. He also says that when a rhythm is taught, it should always be made perfectly clear whether the rhythm is traditional, or a ballet version. He says there is nothing wrong with the ballet versions of the rhythms, but that it must always be made clear that they are not traditional, but are innovations made especially to fit the orchestration and choreography of the ballet.>

>
>Once again, Mamady never said anything against innovation, etc. He just said that it must be made clear what is traditional and what is not. He did mention that he doesn't care for "drum circles" in the freeform jam sense of the term, as it has no structure and no basis in tradition. To use an analogy that Paulo came up with during our dinner with Mamady "The drum is an instrument, like any other. You don't see a bunch of people grab violins and stand around in a circle wailing away". I found this rather humorous. Not to say that I am opposed to drum circles in general, but it did strike me as a rather good analogy.

That was actually Mamady who used the analogy of people not grabbing violins or other instruments and wailing away. I think what he was trying to say was that the Djembe and other African drums have a rich history, a history that is intimately tied to the culture, where each rhythm has a purpose, an ethnic origin. The instrument also has a sound which is called out of it with technique, to wail away without any technique, creates a sound which is to a Djembefola, like that of a squeaky violin to a violinist (or anyone for that matter), very discordant.

To discount or ignore the technique, rhythms and history of any African Drum, is to miss a very significant aspect of the power of that drum. In the techniques, the spirit of player gains a voice, a vocabulary. In the rhythms the spirit makes the vocabulary into a song, a song which has a purpose whether it be for healing, inspiration, prayer, initiation etc., therefore it is so important to know what you are playing, and its effect on the body/mind/spirit all whom the drums sound touches.

Yaya Diallo goes into great depth about the responsibility of the musician for the effect his or her music has upon others.

Mamady has no beef about creating original rhythms, he just wants them to be clearly labeled as such, as Eric pointed out. If the intent of a drum circle is to give our spirits a voice, then that expression of spirit is greatly enhanced by the knowledge of how to call the tone out of the drum with proper technique, an ability and willingness to listen to each other and the rhythmic sensibility that comes from learning the vocabulary and rhythms of that drum. This understanding of the roots of the drum, this incredibly deep legacy of music, wisdom, and cultural heritage becomes a deep well to draw upon to create the new songs and traditions which speak to and for our spirits as artists, and serve to heal us, and connect us to nature and to each other as one people.

I fully support the creative expression of a drum circle, and the community and healing it can initiate, however I believe out of respect for the history and culture(s) of the drum you are playing, and to empower yourself and others, it is very important to continually seek the ancient wisdom, rhythms, cultural applications, history of your instrument.

Fri Oct 4 12:17:04 1996
From: Kent Multer kent@dallas.net
Subject: Tradition, "right/wrong," etc.

I can see both sides of the debate that's going on. I tend toward the creative, rule-breaking, non-traditional approach myself. But Mamady and some other drum teachers are very traditional; it's offensive to them to see people mess around with things that they have worked so hard to master and preserve. So if I'm taking lessons from this kind of teacher, I try hard to put aside my wild creative instinct, and just do what I'm told. At Mamady's workshop in Dallas, there was a guy who was making the right sounds, but not using left/right hands in the correct way; Mamady stopped class quite a few times to correct him and a few others. Later, during Q&A, this guy asked why it was so important to use specific hands. When he got his answer, he nodded, but then muttered something vulgar under his breath. His "question" was really a thinly disguised argument: hey teacher, I don't like part of your teaching, so I'm gonna ignore it.

Some years ago I had a T'ai Chi instructor (Robert W. Smith; perhaps you've read one of his books), who gave out a handout to all new students. It said, in effect, "If you're a karate or aerobics teacher, and you're just here to learn enough so that you can start your own T'ai Chi class, forget it! In a few months, you might learn the motions, but you'll never absorb the underlying spirit which is the most important part. I generally expect students to study with me for five years before I even let them teach beginners." Some of the people we are trying to learn from are way, way, more advanced then we. Sometimes they don't feel like stopping a class for half an hour to explain why they want us to do something a certain way. If we respect them, we should just take their word for it. If we don't like the traditional approach, we can study from people like Arthur Hull who are more free-wheeling in their approach.

The respect for tradition also applies to following the teacher's wishes about taking pictures, making audio or video recordings, and even whether or not people are allowed to watch the class from the sidelines. So it ought to apply to written or computerized transcriptions as well. I don't think Mamady specifically forbid people to make transcriptions; but if you're going to do one, before you send it to the world, it might be good to have a couple of trustworthy friends check it.

Sat Oct 5 09:24:43 1996
From: Nowick Gray nowick@awinc.com
Subject: Re: Tradition v. Ballet, etc.

>>
To use an analogy that Paulo came up with during our dinner with Mamady "The drum is an instrument, like any other. You don't see a bunch of people grab violins and stand around in a circle wailing away" I found this rather humorous. Not to say that I am opposed to drum circles in general, but it did strike me as a rather good analogy.>>

>My gawd! I would dearly LOVE to see a group of violinists wailing away, especially if they were good violinists. Even better, have a jam session with violins and djembes! (BTW, those are the two instruments I've had training in.) I'm serious!>

At risk of yet another post, I must agree, there are always other sides to these stories. As David Thiaw remarked at a recent workshop he gave, drum jams are like batting averages. But when it works...! I am a baseball fan too and so I guess it's natural that I do feel it can be worth it to attempt the unlikely: a good drum jam. At a recent fire circle we even had acoustic guitars (!) in the mix and it worked great. What made it work was

a) everyone was listening to each other and not just pounding away b) the guitarists were willing to play rhythmically c) drummers were willing to accept multiple parts playing simultaneously without losing the security of central pulse and d) enough were willing to play a solid beat consistently.

That experience (at fall equinox celebration where I live) makes about three out of ten tries (.300) but I wouldn't have wanted to miss that one.

By the way, the rhythms played, so far as I could tell, were mostly original improvisations, no doubt inspired by the experience and knowledge players have of traditional patterns. Most of what we come up with as new probably isn't new anyway but has a name somewhere in the annals of millennia of drumming.

Nowick Gray
Argenta, B.C., Canada
nowick@awinc.com
Cougar WebWorks
http://www.he.net/~cougarww/

Thu Oct 31 12:07:09 1996
From: Jasha Levenson LEVENSON@macc.wisc.edu
Subject: ?!

I think it is a bit odd for any American to consider preserving African "traditions" in America. African traditions are preserved by those who live and act their lives according to those established traditions and pass them on to their children. At the same time I realize the need for Americans to try and understand the forces behind music culture traditions, as they are important in healing our "sick" American culture. This is only my opinion, and I too see a major source of this "sickness" being the ego. It is important to note two different kinds of ego (as I see it), that which is unjustified and is easily gotten rid of through individual practice, and that which is "justified" through the enlightenment of practice (but this ego is ridded by sharing your knowledge). I know that no African musician would be impressed by an American playing "traditional" African music, no matter how accurately, fast, or beautifully it was played. I do feel, however, that one would be very impressed by the sounds of America, even when expressed with the djembe or any other traditional percussion instrument.

I do realize the problem of using names of people and rhythms outside their natural context, but those people who know the true essence shouldn't worry about others except to share how they feel and uncover the potential and figure out how it can be used in this place at this time. We are on the verge of a new area...ONE LOVE

Sat Nov 16 11:44:07 1996
From: terrapin@cats.ucsc.edu (Beth Dyer)
Subject: Re: ?!

>I think it is a bit odd for any American to consider preserving African "traditions" in America.> My take on this is that we are NOT preserving African "traditions"; we are preserving traditional arrangements of African music. I have invested considerable time and effort in this pursuit personally, but I certainly would not support the continuation of many African traditions... female genital mutilation being one of the more horrific that springs to mind. (This practice is not found in African societies, nor is it found exclusively in Africa; however, it is found in some parts of the old Mali Empire... some of the same cultures where djembe music originated.)

Thu Oct 31 09:59:55 1996
From: "Bon V. Davis II" bondav@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Rhythm attribution was Re: Frokoroba notation?

>Someone suggested that unless one knows the complete rhythmic structure, songs, dance, social context and other essential elements of a live performance, it is best just to play it without naming it. > This sounds highly reasonable. But one needs some name to refer to the songs. or we here in Austin have said "what we call mangani" "the way we play it"

IMHO Since we are NOT Africans or Ibo folks or trained traditionalists. Since We have not been taught the complete context of these rhythms, We can't and don't want to invoke the full spiritual setting. With *WE* I'm speaking for myself and the few :-) drummers who want to agree with me.

If you Have learned all this then maybe you can handle it, like a "live spirit" drum. but isn't it better to add a local spirit, or let one into your drum that comes from this continent? Maybe an "American-local spirit" would sound better in your drum, since he/she would not be homesick :-) I think the same way about the riddems:

The songs get a new context and a transformed meaning when played over here in a drum circle or a performance, in some REAL way that makes it different then that Acon-con that was played (or still is ) over in west africa (or where ever) by a traditionally trained ensemble, with dancers and a contextual meaning and spiritual charge.

WE are building on hallowed ground, but it is a new structure. We may use traditional building materials, but I don't think we build the old temple. Comments?

>>please, please, please, be very careful when attributing information to them [African teachers], particularly in a public forum such as this one. >>

>I agree 100%. Please take great care when posting anything to this list, attributing it to a certain teacher or culture and then naming it as a rhythm from "Source". I thought that one of the important things explored at the Facilitators Playshop was the responsibility we all have to share information regarding what Arthur calls "ethno-specific" rhythms with a high degree of accuracy / certainty. Someone suggested that unless one knows the complete rhythmic structure, songs, dance, social context and other essential elements of a live performance, it is best just to play it without naming it. An extreme viewpoint in some ways, but one which recognizes an ideal level of responsibility for each of us to aspire to when posting notation for potentially millions of eyes.>

- Bon: - T 10,000 T
Returning is the motion of the Tao. Yielding is the way of the Tao
The ten thousand things are born of being.
Being is born of not being.
bondav@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Bon V. Davis II)

Fri Nov 1 07:30:41 1996
From: Taylor Djembist@starnetinc.com
Subject: Re: Rhythm attribution was Re: Frokoroba notation? Bon V. Davis II wrote:

> IMHO Since we are NOT Africans or Ibo folks or trained traditionalists. Since We have not been taught the complete context of these rhythms, We can't and don't want to invoke the full spiritual setting...>

I guess one of the questions I see from this is 'is it possible to keep the respect for the creators of the rhythm intact while we do (learn, practice, perform) these rhythms outside of their culture of birth?' I am not the first to say that the main problem that Americans in particular face in approaching the drum, is respect for the drum. From the respect of the drum, or lack thereof, comes respect for the rhythm, culture and people. If you respect something, then when you have occasion to emulate that thing, the respect is in the mix. With respect one aspires for what they create to be an homage.

What if you don't have a good way to gauge if your efforts are actually not totally disrespecting the drum by accident? This can easily happen in the absence of an african teacher, some instructional videos, an american teacher who *really* knows, ie has experienced first-hand, or other study of the culture. But, again, if we have respect for the all-powerful drum, I believe these things will naturally follow.

They did with me at least and clearly to a great number of people tuned in to this very channel. I also believe that one only need listen to your drum, really listen, to understand that it clearly beckons respect. Yet, another issue is that if your drum is not good enough (I hate saying that, but I have seen so many drums that, for reasons usually related to green wood, cracks, etc, are incapable of letting the true spirit of the drum speak) you need to hear someone else's drum that is, to enhance your frame of reference. My first drum sounded like it had a raccoon sleeping in it. I had it reheaded and looked over three times, once by West African djembefola, and nothing changed. When I eventually heard what they were *supposed* to sound like, my world completely changed.

Sat Nov 16 12:29:27 1996
From: terrapin@cats.ucsc.edu (Beth Dyer)
Subject: Re: Rhythm attribution was Re: Frokoroba notation?

>I guess one of the questions I see from this is "is it possible to keep the respect for the creators of the rhythm intact while we do (learn, practice, perform) these rhythms outside of their culture of birth?"> I definitely think we can! Respect is an feeling of deferential honor and, while we may or may not show respect in the same way that the creators of the rhythms may have known *within* their own culture, we can give honor and show esteem for these creators.

>I am not the first to say that the main problem that Americans in particular face in approaching the drum, is respect for the drum. From respect of the drum, or lack thereof, comes respect for the rhythm, culture and people.>

I agree that respecting the drum is an issue for many in the US. I also agree that if one truly respects the drum, respect for the culture will follow. The drum is such an integral part of the culture that it confounds me to think otherwise. One later poster said something to the effect that one may be oblivious to the cultural context of the drum when one first hears it so the cultural context is irrelevant. True respect for the drum will draw that cultural context to you, since the two are so inextricably linked.

That said, I don't believe that I have to agree that every aspect of that culture is a great idea. FGM, for example, is not something that I would label as a great idea. However, I do respect the rights of a culture to practice their ways, and I do try to understand how such practices may have arisen, what ends they may serve and so on. Discounting one's emotional reactions to something in the interest of furthering understanding is a positive step in my book.

As an aside, I think that Taylor's meaning in the last sentence quoted above would be clearer if he had added something to indicate that "a lack thereof [of respect]" does NOT foster respect for the culture. >If you respect something, then when you have occasion to emulate that thing, the respect is in the mix. With respect one aspires for what they create to be an homage.>

>
>What if you don't have a good way to gauge if your efforts are actually not totally disrespecting the drum by accident? But, again, if we have respect for the all-powerful drum, I believe these things will naturally follow.>

Respect abides in the heart. I believe the cosmos to be a forgiving entity to those with pure intent. Besides, the *desire* to find out will draw either you to a source of the appropriate information, or the source to you.

>I also believe that one only need listen to your drum, really listen, to understand that it clearly beckons respect.>

Definitely! My djembe taught me many things in the first few weeks it resided with me; one of them was "go to a teacher and learn how to play me!"

Fri Nov 1 06:02:05 1996
From: Nowick Gray nowick@awinc.com
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

>If you have learned all this then maybe you can handle it, like a "live spirit" drum. but isn't it better to add a local spirit, or let one into your drum that comes from this continent? Maybe an "American-local spirit" would sound better in your drum, since he/she would not be homesick :-)

I think the same way about the riddems: WE are building on hallowed ground, but it is a new structure. We may use traditional building materials, but I don't think we build the old temple. Comments?> I agree with your point of view, as they say, 100%. It seems from this recurrent controversy on the list that we drummers are divided like other citizens into the usual spectrum: conservative, liberal, radical, etc. To my way of thinking, your approach gives a good balance: respect of the traditional roots with freedom to inject fresh energy and interpretation. Structure plus improvisation. I find especially relevant your invoking the actual time and place we live in, our culture happening in the present as a bridge from past to future; and I would add mention of the democratic tradition which means freedom of individual style. Thanks for offering these perspectives!

Nowick Gray
nowick@awinc.com
Cougar WebWorks, http://www.he.net/~cougarww/
******************************

Fri Nov 1 11:59:30 1996
From: drum@aloha.net (Michael Wall)
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

>It seems from this recurrent controversy on the list that we drummers are divided like other citizens into the usual spectrum: conservative, liberal, radical, etc. To my way of thinking, your approach gives a good balance: respect of the traditional roots with freedom to inject fresh energy and interpretation. Structure plus improvisation. I find especially relevant your invoking the actual time and place we live in, our culture happening in the present as a bridge from past to future; and I would add mention of the democratic tradition which means freedom of individual style. Thanks for offering these perspectives!>

I think that we can and must develop our own drum culture and musical style. What I feel uncomfortable with is using traditional names from another culture on our mutations. In addition to misrepresenting a proud and ancient culture's rituals (and perhaps offending their ancestors!), our children will grow up having learned inaccurate information.

My vote is to mutate, innovate, and improvisate all we want - and NOT use the traditional cultural names for anything other than the most accurate rendition of a rhythm/song/dance we are capable of. In addition to doing our USA Jazz Thing, let's ALSO create part of our drum culture to include a deep respect for the source traditions which birth/ are birthing it.

Fri Nov 1 23:40:12 1996
From: "Bon V. Davis II" bondav@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

I am glad this discussion is going. Michael's mention of Our USA Jazz thing in regards to the Drum culture we are building is good, Allows for improvisation and incorporation and innovation and ROOTS. "New names for new permutations" Sounds good to me, Michael

Nowick also remarked on the Geographic and Temporal sensibility I find so important. I think it is most important to be true to the present moment, then to the past (tradition) that got you to that moment. (my meditation training leaking out :-) )

The idea that we Americans are a motley mixture of many breeds and hence we have the strength of MANY backgrounds to help us out is a good one. This may be a character of our geography as well as history, what with so many different environments ands genealogies. The ancient greeks had an idea that the climate and topography of a Country determined it's national character. I don't want to go too far with that idea but it seems useful here. I think that spirits, or whatever talks through our drums >;-) are geographically specific in this way just like humans are.

Even as we on this list are netziens we can celebrate this diversity as we build a Global Drum Community. Many of us that are contributing are not Americans, nor Africans, just drummers I guess. Aren't the same questions and answers arising in Australia or Europe or wherever ??

There is another thread here I missed much of that had similar talk from Arthur and others about making our own "in the moment" music with a nod and a bow to the roots, but not a rip-off. I sense agreement all over! I'm feeling better all the time about being a white guy with a drum. Not a ripoff artist (the charge must have been levied against all of us at one time).

Still, I recall a swell moment playing Djembe on the street here in Austin. It was very sad night and I was not getting a good response from the passersby. So I am just jamming along by myself. Then this AfroAmerican MiddleAged guy walks by and proudly, happily announces to me "That's African music you are playing."

----------- Bon T10TT
As the poet Lu Yu wrote: The clouds above us join and separate,
The breeze in the courtyard leaves and returns.
Life is like that, so why not relax? Who can stop us from celebrating?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
bondav@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu

Sat Nov 2 04:43:45 1996
From: Barkman488@aol.com
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

I have decided, at the risk of being busted by the Rhythm Police, to rename all my rhythms that may be possibly mutated. This would be all of them. From now on all rhythms shall have no name and be referred to as the "rhythm formerly known as such and such". Am I protected from scrutiny now? Maybe our dances have a wrong step in them as well. They will be known as the "Dance formerly called such and such". Now I'm free to make up my own history and stories about these rhythms and dances.

So if you're ever drumming with Barky, don't stare at my hands and give me that dirty look. This is my rhythm.

Mon Nov 4 18:56:58 1996
From: Nowick Gray nowick@awinc.com
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

I like your rhythm. I think when I steal it from you I'll call it "Lighten Up." The 12/8 version might be, "Y'all Lighten Up," and in Canada I'd tack on a flam and call it, "Y'all lighten up, eh?"

Sun Nov 3 09:35:49 1996
From: drumpath@aztec.asu.edu (SULE GREGORY C. WILSON)
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

>>I think that we can and must develop our own drum culture and musical style.>> Kim Atkinson wrote:

>Thank you Michael! It is time for everyone to take responsibility for naming and creating new rhythms and dances which address the needs of today.>

Yes, yes, yes! AND, even if you are doing someone else's stuff, you are most often playing it in a U.S.an way, with U.S. swing, or a 2/4 thump.

One reason there's so much argument on rhythms, is that the song varies from village to village. When I grew up in D.C. you could tell what part of town someone grew up in by watching how they did the D.C. Bop-by how they danced. The same holds for the rest of the world. Be who you are, and make what you need.

Mon Nov 4 12:00:54 1996
From: Thomas Westgard t-westgard@onu.edu
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 60

>SULE GREGORY C. WILSON wrote:
>
> One reason there's so much argument on rhythms, is that the song varies from village to village. When I grew up in D.C. you could tell what part of town someone grew up in by watching how they did the D.C. Bop-by how they danced. >

>B.BIRD wrote:
>Thank you Sule!
> I think American students of drumming often tend to look at the rhythms we are attempting to learn as though they are frozen in time and space, not realizing that drum music, much as other music, is not static, and does not stay the same, but flows and grows and changes as it moves from place to place and drummer to drummer. Oftentimes, (IMHO) the rhythms are more CONCEPTS than finite entities, and what really matters in the originating cultures is the dance, and that the drumming support the dance. >

Maybe I shouldn't bring this thread up again, but I will. I agree totally with these two posts from Sule Greg Wilson & B.Bird. (Am I a bad person for thinking of large yellow feathers?)

Don't these two posts go absolutely counter to the idea that any rhythm may be designated as "traditional" or "non-traditional?" There has been a lot of fire about keeping the tradition pure, but I don't think there is "a" tradition.

Transferring rhythms by _oral tradition_ (or stories, songs, whatever) is subject to the "telephone game effect," as well as bad memories, so I can't imagine that we really have any idea what people were doing even one generation ago. This being the case, what can one mean by "tradition?" Tradition on this list seems to be defined as what certain specific Africans are teaching in this country, but in linguistics, those would be called "idiolects," or "one person's version." Which makes us equally authoritative. Which isn't traditional. You spin me right round, baby, right round, like a record, baby, right round, round-round.

Mon Nov 4 16:58:48 1996
From: lrowland@metz.une.edu.au
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 60

Thomas Westgard wrote:
>
SNIP
>
> Transferring rhythms by _oral tradition_ (or stories, songs, whatever) is subject to the "telephone game effect," as well as bad memories, so I can't imagine that we really have any idea what people were doing even one generation ago. This being the case, what can one mean by "tradition?" Tradition on this list seems to be defined as what certain specific Africans are teaching in this country, but in linguistics, those would be called "idiolects," or "one person's version." Which makes us equally authoritative. Which isn't traditional. You spin me right round, baby, right round, like a record, baby, right round, round-round.>

I'm not too convinced of your logic; you are extrapolating to the extreme. Tradition is not a conundrum that ideolects carry around in their heads nor is it something that a whole race adheres to. It is something between those extremes. As an outsiders to a culture and its traditions, we have the obligation to stand in respect of them. If a 'teacher' says 'this is exactly how this rhythm is played', you must be mindful that they are talking about a context and the another teacher my be as pedantic about the context that they know. All this means is that there is no one correct version, and no one person has a complete overview of any culture - not even their own. However, in the context that you apprehend a teacher, it is advisable to respect their sensibilities or be prepared to be in conflict.

I recently had a highly respected teacher/performer state publicly that all djembe music originates from Guinea. There is no way in the world that I would jeopardise my relationship with him by pointing out the obvious anthropological faultiness of such a statement. I have also had African teachers say that music was invented in Africa. It's best to leave it where it lies.

In regard to authentic renditions of pieces, if you perform what you learn from an indigenous teacher then you at least can rest in the conscience that you are not bastardizing another culture to any great extent. If you wish to invent and call it African music you are doing harm to African culture by disseminating misinformation.

I suggest the reason that many people take up djembe is because the playing of it invokes an 'African ethos', whatever that may be. Many of us look to the indigenous teachers as the true and rightful authority of this music and see them as mediums who can put us in touch with a spiritual relationship to music. And it works to some degree because we keep hanging in there, maintaining the worship, devotion, etc,.

If you choose to create your own djembe music, you will have to confront the following question at some point: what are you trying to invoke? It is a truism that music is not just notes, that sounds which are meant to be listened to, have their own cultural baggage, whether it is your own baggage or baggage you take on. Western European culture, that is, our culture, does not yet have a strong connection with drumming as music and the activity which we engage in is anomalous to the mainstream. If what we do can be somehow meaningful to an expanding subset of our culture, then it will be assimilated into it. On the other hand, it will remain a small enclave of devotees.

Some thoughts...
Cheers,
-- Lindsay Rowlands, Faculty of Arts, University of New England, Armidale NSW Australia.

Tue Nov 5 18:56:25 1996
From: lrowland@metz.une.edu.au
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 61

Thomas Westgard wrote:
> Thanks for your response, Lindsay. I was afraid that I would just get flamed, but instead I get your very thoughtful, insightful response. Rather than try to respond to all of the deep questions you have asked, which are valid, I have picked out the one which I see as the ultimate concentration: "you will have to confront the following question at some point: what are you trying to invoke? It is a truism that music is not just notes, that sounds which are meant to be listened to, have their own cultural baggage, whether it is your own baggage or baggage you take on."

>
> I hope I will not misattribute your intent if I say that this was in response to my suggestion that an identifiable "tradition" to the exclusion of variation, could not be derived from an oral tradition, due to the inherent vagarities in an oral tradition, such as the telephone game effect and the fallibility of memory. >

SNIP
> So, in answer to your question of what I am trying to invoke, the answer is: All of one's actions, even those directed by the culture in which you find yourself, are options, not imperatives. In one sense this is a beautiful thought, as those things you don't like, you may choose not to do. You are in no way bound by history, religion, gender roles, culture, or family. The downside is that you are absolutely individually responsible for the things you do. There is no excuse to be found in history, religion, gender roles, culture, or family. You decided to stay within that framework and thus decided to do those things that you do. I think Sartre said things much like that. That exhilarating and horrifying feeling of freedom is what I am invoking by the way I play and think about djembe.>

Hmmm, I agree with much of what you have said, however, I am coming from the position that, to be alive is to be involved in culture - that everything we do and think is culture. On one level we share the culture with every human alive, that is, we eat, sleep, reproduce, etc, - these are the things we have in common. At the opposite extreme, there are things we do/think as individuals which are not in common with any other humans alive.

My argument has to do with how can things we borrow from other cultures have meaning when transplanted. Though we may make always make free choices, we are constrained by culture it is part of the human condition. People who do not abide by the tacit rules of a culture are abandoned by it and are identified as being disfunctional. These are some of the defining characteristics of psychosis.

-- Lindsay Rowlands, Faculty of Arts, University of New England, Armidale, NSW Australia.

****************************
Wed Nov 6 14:01:31 1996
From: Thomas Westgard t-westgard@onu.edu
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 62

Lindsay Rowlands wrote:
>Hmmm, I agree with much of what you have said, however, I am coming from the position that, to be alive is to be involved in culture - that everything we do and think is culture. [snip/MTF] People who do not abide by the tacit rules of a culture are abandoned by it and are identified as being disfunctional. These are some of the defining characteristics of psychosis.>

Right, exactly! These negative attributions are totally culturally based, not grounded in anything free-standingly sensible, when the unusual behaviors don't interfere with the first group of things, like eat, sleep, reproduce, etc. These negative attributions of "you're weird, you're bad, you should be killed or thrown out of our village" in tribal cultures show their ugly face in our culture as "you're ill, you need help, we'll lock you up and pump you full of drugs."

Before the drum culture in our society gets locked into repressive norms about what's good and bad, and if you're inventive you must go away and be quiet, we have the opportunity to allow ourselves more freedom than what some would prefer. We have the opportunity to instill a new tenet of tolerance in _our_ drumming tradition.

Thus I am hostile to this concept of a certain "correct" tradition, which can't really exist beyond the idea that in some sense you're being true to a greater "rightness" than one person's version. Even the people on this list who advocate subservience to a "traditional" way of drumming admit that the names of rhythms change from person to person and village to village, and the rhythms themselves vary from person to person and village to village, and, presumably, though it's not demonstrable, from decade to decade. What tradition is that? You dig into what "tradition" seems to mean, and the more you dig, the less substance it seems to have until it disappears entirely. But it seems to serve some useful purpose, because it has so many adherents.

The useful purpose might be that when DrummerX calls a rhythm "traditional," DrummerX invokes a power greater than the individual. No single person can create a tradition, so it provides justification for believing that this rhythm, and by extension, DrummerX, is elevated above the other people. And that's the exclusionary dogma I would like to avoid.

Before I get flamed too badly, I should perhaps relate the story of the first time I met "traditionalist" drummers. It was at Starwood, and that year anyway, there were two large drum circles, one below in a dome by the woods, and one on a clearing on a hill, by a large tepee. I went down to the dome, where I had a great time, blending and mixing with the grouples there. I decided to sample the other one, up on the hill, and wow, were those people filled with hate. I have never in my life found such a hostile group of drummers, before or since. People started bumping into me, to try to intimidate me, people stood near me and played ridiculously loudly to try to drown me out, people stared at me hatefully... It was amazing, evil, and I left in about five minutes. Yes, there was a better way to get rid of me, but more importantly, the basic idea on which they were acting, "we are superior to you," was also wrong, evil. It took me a while to learn to separate the two. At first I felt bad, as if I had intruded, but then, really, since it's so common to join a public drum circle, if they were a specific group, they should have had people who were in charge of explaining to people like me who showed up that, although this appeared on the outside to be like any other public drum circle, it was a performance by a specific group, and I should not intrude. Or, they could have offered to include me, but clearly that was totally out of the question. In retrospect it's sometimes funny, that the Earth Nature Drum Circle, (some name like that) would be so full of hate. Still, it left a horrible taste in my mouth.

Well, my hour's up for drum therapy. Sorry if I revealed too much. Tradition is a basis for exclusion. Exclusion leads to fear of the unfamiliar. Fear of the unfamiliar breeds hate. Hate kills.

Thu Nov 7 13:42:07 1996
From: brenda@ttlnet.com (Jason Hann)
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 62

Thomas Westgard wrote:
>The useful purpose might be that when DrummerX calls a rhythm "traditional," DrummerX invokes a power greater than the individual.>

Some, not all, do find "power" in screaming "tradition".
> it provides justification for believing that this rhythm, and by extension, DrummerX, is elevated above the other people. And that's the exclusionary dogma I would like to avoid...Before I get flamed too badly, the basic idea on which they were acting, "we are superior to you," was also wrong, evil.>

Bullseye, whammo-bammo, biff, bap, boom, go, do, patapata, 1 e a u, right on the money !!!!! The ability to be able to drum at any level does not hold ANY inherent values of righteousness or spirituality. You can learn many of these things THROUGH drumming, but the second you catch yourself looking down on someone because of their ability to do something, the more work you need to do inside to straighten yourself out...BEFORE you think to sneer at others. No flame here, Thomas.

Real tradition does equal strength, however. Tradition is about deeper things than drumming. It's a way of life. Roots. the stuff that determines how you're gonna' act, now, and later. Music of all cultures just happens to be one of the strongest REFLECTIONS of life, in general. Some people try to chase a lifestyle through physical imitation when it's the mental mindset that determines your real life. Drumming, in itself, is not a way of life but only a means of expressing life. OUT!!!

Wed Nov 6 23:00:26 1996
From: Rodger Osgood rodger@exotech.com
Subject: In defense of tradition (was Re: DJEMBE-L digest 62)

At 05:01 PM 11/6/96 -0500, Thomas Westgard wrote:
>Thus I am hostile to this concept of a certain "correct" tradition, which can't really exist beyond the idea that in some sense you're being true to a greater "rightness" than one person's version. Even the people on this list who advocate subservience to a "traditional" way of drumming admit that the names of rhythms change from person to person and village to village, and the rhythms themselves vary from person to person and village to village, and, presumably, though it's not demonstrable, from decade to decade. What tradition is that? >

It is a rich and living tradition rather than a dead, static one. I believe it is wrong to assume that because a tradition has variations and flavors in different places, that it is somehow invalid or has no continuity. As a linguist, you know that a language will vary from place to place and will change over time, but does that mean it has no value? Does it imply that one person can't use it to communicate with another even if they "speak funny"? Likewise, traditional rhythms communicate the culture and practices of a people, and help to shape their identity as a member of the group. In an earlier post you also said:

>I hope I will not misattribute your intent if I say that this was in response to my suggestion that an identifiable "tradition" to the exclusion of variation, could not be derived from an oral tradition, due to the inherent vagarities in an oral tradition, such as the telephone game effect and the fallibility of memory.>

Having studied drumming in Africa, I believe you seriously underestimate the power of oral traditions. I spent 6 months in Tamale, Ghana studying with Abubakari Lunna, who is a "Drum Chief" and master drummer of the Dagbamba people. In that culture the drummers are oral historians who maintain 700 years of history by singing and playing the "Salima" praise name songs of their chiefs. He can recite the songs of every paramount chief of Dagbon over this period, as well as the complete lineage of several towns and villages within it. Sure, there are styles or variations that one drummer might play differently than another, but the core set of rhythms and songs is well known and recognized by every drummer in that culture. Their drumming is "timpanophonic" meaning the sounds of the drum relate directly to the sounds of their spoken language, and every part to every rhythm has words that correspond to that rhythm. To make up a rhythm that has no words is "niema-niema drumming" - nonsense drumming.

I think the real question that you are trying to raise is: Do these traditional rhythms have any value here in the West? Should we as American drummers make up our own rhythms and traditions or learn from the rich body of knowledge that is contained in the "traditional rhythms". I think there is room for both, and I find a great deal of value in learning from my "elders".

>Before I get flamed too badly, I should perhaps relate the story of the first time I met "traditionalist" drummers. It was at Starwood, and that year anyway, there were two large drum circles, one below in a dome by the woods, and one on a clearing on a hill, by a large tepee. I went down to the dome, where I had a great time, blending and mixing with the grouples there. I decided to sample the other one, up on the hill, and wow, were those people filled with hate.>

I too, have been to several Starwoods, and may well have been among the circle on the hill, which was organized by the Earth Drum Council. I am sorry you felt rejected, but let me assure you, I, and the people in that circle that I know are not "filled with hate." We do, however, try to create a drum circle that is more than a bunch of drummers pounding away. We try to create a musical conversation, with different parts speaking back and forth, and leaving space for other voices to be heard. Sometimes, we use "traditional" rhythms to give ourselves a framework to create that conversation. Do we play them the "right" way? probably not. To a purist, I'm sure our renditions are sloppy and poorly executed. But these traditional rhythms provide a structure where a large group of drummers can find different grooves (other than BaDaBaDa in 4) and can co-create that poly rhythmic conversation that makes drumming fun. The key to all this is to _LISTEN_.

> I have never in my life found such a hostile group of drummers, before or since. People started bumping into me, to try to intimidate me, people stood near me and played ridiculously loudly to try to drown me out, people stared at me hatefully... It was amazing, evil, and I left in about five minutes.>

If you were getting that much flak from the circle, you have to ask yourself: Why? Did you place yourself in the middle of a group of drummers that were trying to communicate with each other, obstructing their sight lines? Were you playing loud intense leads without making space for other voices? Were you listening?

> the basic idea on which they were acting, "we are superior to you," was also wrong, evil.>

EDC drum circles are _not_ about "we are superior to you", none of us are professional drummers or really even top flight amateurs. It is about creating something together that is greater than any one part or person, about listening and making space for other voices.

There is certainly a difference between this and an unstructured, anything goes, drum jam. In a jam, every one is often filling up all the spaces, playing all the notes, and there is no opportunity to really listen to each other. People who are used to Rainbow style jams sometimes find the attempt to create structure and space in a drum circle restrictive or foreign. The beauty of Starwood is that there is room for both the unstructured Gruple Dome jam, and the more structured drum circles.

I have been to many drum circles and always I sit back and listen to what's going on before I start to play, then find a voice that supports and complements the rhythm, and only step out to play variations or leads once I'm solidly in the groove and feel there is space for me to speak out.

Once again, I am very sorry that you felt unwelcome and rejected by the circle. I know that EDC works hard to create a space that is safe for people to play together and enjoy the magic of drumming. If you ever run across an EDC circle again, I urge you to come, watch what is going on, listen, and join in. And, if you don't like what is happening in that circle, there is always Gruple Dome, they'll be pounding away until dawn.

Mon Nov 11 22:50:50 1996
From MorwenTF@aol.com
Subject: My 2 cents on tradition and culture (long)

Whew! It's not every day one gets called "evil" in a public forum! At the risk of sounding defensive, I must reply to Thomas Westgard's description of his experience at the EDC drum circle at Starwood in 1994. (That's when the teepee was there.) I was not actually present at the circle to witness the incident he is referring to, because I was four months pregnant at the time and, to my great dismay, found that I had to go to bed early every night, missing every drum circle of the gathering. I could hear the drumming from my tent, though, and it sounded sweet (exacerbating my distress!).

Somehow, in Thomas's posts, what started out as "bumping into" him in what he considered an intimidating way escalated to full-blown violence. In his later posts you would think there was a fist fight at the fire! Even without witnessing what actually happened, I am sure that there was no violence intended. I am sorry if he felt unwelcome, and I also see that he left after five minutes, forming a judgment that he has carried ever since.

The reason we call ourselves "Earth Drum Council" is that council is an integral part of what we do. By sitting in circle and talking about what we do, why we do it, and how we do it (in addition to DOING IT), we have organically grown into a community of folks who share certain perspectives and build on our experiences. You might even say we've created some traditions. Some of these concern how physical space is set up at an EDC drum fire, with the drummers on one side of the fire and space for dancers on the other side, as well as space for dancers to circle the fire. We have "traditions" of making eye contact, grouping jun-juns and other bass drums together, occasionally changing the energy by stopping the drumming (sometimes with a break, sometimes by bringing the volume down slowly) to make space for a song, a poem, an "OM", or some other offering from the circle. Often we pass chocolate along with the water. Facilitation is a group affair, no one person is in charge. These "traditions' evolved over some years of getting together to talk about what works and doesn't work. At gatherings like Starwood, we generally council the day after a fire circle (in preparation for the next one!), and the council is open to anyone at the gathering. We also hold a "formal" workshop (i.e., it's on the gathering program) which is exactly the same discussion: What works, what doesn't work, us sharing our experience and inviting everyone there to contribute. The point here is that there's nothing exclusionary intended. Although there is a core of 20-25 people who have been drumming together for a while and have been instrumental (no pun intended) in developing these traditions, it's an open circle in which everyone is welcome to participate. And many people do.

What works and doesn't work for what? you might ask. Well, the goal is to create a container where there's space for all the voices to be heard, to create music with give and take, back and forth, conversation and silence. Funky, swingin, flowing, flying, whispering, seductive, insistent, whirling, transform your Self kind of music. A container for ecstatic dancing that's grounded to the Earth. It's hard to describe it, but you know it when you feel it.

It's ironic to see us called "traditionalists", when what we do is certainly not true to any particular African (or any other "indigenous") tradition. We've caught our fair share of shit from African and Native American sources alike for not being "traditional" enough. When we work with teachers or particular rhythms, we are careful to respect them, and to honor the sources from which we draw. When we bring our Selves to the fire circle, all that we have learned as well as all that we are, all the Spirit that we can access from within and without, we are doing something quite different. Together with all those everywhere who are drumming from the heart, we are creating a new culture.

At the heart of all the living drum traditions is the relationship of drumming to spirit, of rhythm to life. IMHO, in western cultures (read: white european cultures and their descendant, white american culture) where rhythm and the body were exorcised from the culture, that relationship became disrupted. Many of us who grew up in that culture have been drawn to the spirit of traditional drumming, partly because that culture is so cut off from the physical connection to spirit expressed in drumming and dance. But the spirit is not in playing it exactly "right". No matter how many traditional rhythms we learn, and how much we understand and respect the original cultural context of the music that inspires us, it's what's between Spirit and our Selves that counts. By creating our own traditions and passing them to our children, we do indeed create a new culture, one that has a certain quality of connection to Spirit in common with "traditional" or indigenous cultures, but which is authentic for who we are here and now.

Many thanks to all on this list who have shared wisdom on this topic. Especially to Sule Greg Wilson, Lindsay Rowlands, Barbara Bird, Michael Wall, your words have illuminated my way on this path. Thanks also to Rodger Osgood, my dear brother, for his clear and grounded words. I could not clip everything I wanted to acknowledge and respond to, and I apologize if my failure to do that leaves any of my comments out of context. I appreciate the existence of this list and the willingness of its members to listen to each other. This thread alone has made the avalanche of email worth it! Where else could I sit in council with all of you?

Tue Nov 12 17:42:39 1996
From: moorej@brolga.atea.mat.army.defence.gov.au (John Moore)
Subject: Rhythm exorcised from Western culture

Morwen wrote:
>At the heart of all the living drum traditions is the relationship of drumming to spirit, of rhythm to life. IMHO, in western cultures (read: white european cultures and their descendant, white american culture) where rhythm and the body were exorcised from the culture, that relationship became disrupted. Many of us who grew up in that culture have been drawn to the spirit of traditional drumming, partly because that culture is so cut off from the physical connection to spirit expressed in drumming and dance.> Yes, but this is not entirely true. Rhythm, dance and actual hand drumming were and still are important in Irish culture, at least.

I know what you mean, though, and this must be what attracts us "Westerners" to those cultures where rhythm, dance and music have real importance, unlike ours , where music is used as entertainment for a passive audience, or to sell things, or to calm us down in lifts, or at best to move compartmentalised groups (your classical devotees, your jazz cats, your moshers, etc). (Sorry, generalising here and talking to the "Westerners" on the list).

Maybe that's what the "call of the drum" is, that has been talked about here: the sound of the drum somehow reminds us of some distant past before we threw our music away, because we all must have had real music once, whatever our "ancestry".

Sat Nov 16 14:07:1 1996
From: terrapin@cats.ucsc.edu (Beth Dyer)
Subject: Re: DJEMBE-L digest 60

Once again, I continue to live somewhat in the past by responding to an old post. Some time ago, Thomas Westgard posted: >Don't these two posts go absolutely counter to the idea that any rhythm may be designated as "traditional" or "non-traditional?" There has been a lot of fire about keeping the tradition pure, but I don't think there is "a" tradition. >

I interpret this statement as a huge slap in the face to people of the cultures which spawned djembe music. I have had the pleasure of studying with many talented teachers, some of whom are considered masters within their own culture. *They* (the masters) certainly maintain that there is a tradition, and most are rather upset by the reality that the musical aspect of their traditional cultures is being mangled (largely outside the culture) and lost (largely from within the culture). To clarify, they are upset that the traditional *arrangements* of the music are being mangled and lost. The reason for the loss is that the young of the culture are not interested in learning the traditional music, instead focusing on ballet arrangements (if they are interested in djembe music) or prefer listening to Western rock and rap, as Boo Kunta posted recently. >Transferring rhythms by _oral tradition_ (or stories, songs, whatever) is subject to the "telephone game effect," as well as bad memories, so I can't imagine that we really have any idea what people were doing even one generation ago. This being the case, what can one mean by "tradition?" >

I think Thomas is mistaken here. The masters largely didn't learn by casual passing of rhythms from one person to the next, as tends to happen in the US. Instead, traditionally rhythms were passed from master to student (some of whom eventually earned the "master" designation themselves) by years of intensive study on a daily basis. As one poster indicated here, physical violence could result from messing up the rhythm; I've heard this from more than one master from more than one cultural background. In oral traditions, memory functions differently than in traditions that rely on the written word. I think that generally it may be stronger, particularly when reinforced with discipline (which is a *big* part of learning drumming in traditional cultures. .

There are no tapes to confirm either Thomas' view or mine. However, based on many conversations and much study with various teachers, I'd say Thomas is incorrect to assume that rhythms constantly change like a game of "Gossip". This not to say that there is no innovation; however, that is usually reserved for the soloist within the feeling of the rhythm. The soloist does not have free reign, either. He must play to the dance, since the two are not separate in the traditional cultural context. (Oloshua had an excellent post on this topic several weeks back.) Innovative dancers may spark innovative music. Sometimes soloists play to different movements (e.g., hands as opposed to feet) and add innovation to the music that way, as long as there are not traditional phrases that go with the particular movement.

>Tradition on this list seems to be defined as what certain specific Africans are teaching in this country, but in linguistics, those would be called "idiolects," or "one person's version." >

I disagree. If one goes to Africa, one will find teachers teaching the same patterns for the same rhythms. There have been some local folks go to Africa, study with teachers there and return playing exactly the same arrangements we learn here. Always keep in mind that there is a distinction between ballet arrangements and traditional arrangements. The confusion between these two general styles is a big part of the confusion we experience here in the US.

I've seen footage of djembe playing in remote villages in Guinea. It's not the same thing as the ballet, although there are similarities. Ballet has altered the art form to something interesting to the world audience (largely Westerners).

Another point of confusion stems from some of the teachers who teach here in the US. Sometimes the language barrier is too great for the teacher to effectively communicate the nuances; other times, the teacher is not really a master and may just make up arrangements to cash in on our interest. This happens frequently. I don't think that most of the people who do this are evil in intent, they are just trying to pay the rent. However, the result is a lot of contention and disagreement in the ranks of the burgeoning American drum culture.

Thu Nov 7 14:49:20 1996
From: Lindsay Rowlands lrowland@metz.une.edu.au
Subject: Re: "timpanophonic" drumming?

> >[Rodger Osgood wrote:] Their drumming is "timpanophonic" meaning the sounds of the drum relate directly to the sounds of their spoken language, and every part to every rhythm has words that correspond to that rhythm. To make up a rhythm that has no words is "niema-niema drumming" - nonsense drumming.>>

> > Rodger -- I find this fascinating. I've read bits and pieces about talking drums, but you're the first person I've encountered who had actually studied it. Can you tell us more? Which drum tones go with which vocal sounds? [snip/MTF]] >

Drums may be used to 'speak' by imitating rhythms and pitch movement of ordinary speech. Note that many African languages are tonal, that is, different pitches applied to syllables change the meaning of the word containing them. Languages such as Twi and Ewe from Ghana are such languages. Drum 'talking' is not a codification of language, but an imitation of it. Nonetheless, understanding drum talk is something that must be learned by speakers of the language. I have been told by a number of Twi speakers that not everyone in their cultural group automatically understands what is being 'spoken' by the talking drum.

Talking drums are usually identified as the hour glass type found throughout West Africa, viz., donna, tama, luna, etc, but 'talking' is not only confined to this type. The atumpan drums, a pair of goblet shaped drums, are very important in the culture of the Ashanti of Ghana. I attended a concert a few years ago given by Ko Nimo and Kojo Noah Awusu of Central Ghana. Noah performed a short segment on solo flute, which I found interesting but didn't attach much significance to it. Later in discussion with my Ashanti friends, they told me of the very sad story Noah told on the flute. Noah, also told me that he was close to tears as he was performing. The point is, that is not only drums that can be used for 'talking'.

In a workshop with Ko, he told us about when national radio was first broadcast in Nigeria. This was set up by Europeans, and they were apparently ignorant about much of Nigerian culture. Someone had a bright idea to use the talking drums, live, as the 'sound signature' for station. It wasn't until lots of complaints flooded in that the administrators realised what was happening. The drummers were exercising some creativity in their playing. As the story goes, they had become a bit bored and were spicing up their performance with 'reports' of whose wife was sleeping with who, etc.

-- Lindsay Charles Rowlands, Faculty of Arts, University of New England, Armidale NSW Australia.

Fri Nov 8 20:47:54 1996
From: Taylor Djembist@starnetinc.com
Subject: Rhythmic Darwinism

*SCHNIP*
> Thus I am hostile to this concept of a certain "correct" tradition, which can't really exist beyond the idea that in some sense you're being true to a greater "rightness" than one person's version. Even the people on this list who advocate subservience to a "traditional" way of drumming admit that the names of rhythms change from person to person and village to village, and the rhythms themselves vary from person to person and village to village, and, presumably, though it's not demonstrable, from decade to decade. What tradition is that? You dig into what "tradition" seems to mean, and the more you dig, the less substance it seems to have until it disappears entirely. But it seems to serve some useful purpose, because it has so many adherents. The useful purpose might be that when DrummerX calls a rhythm "traditional," DrummerX invokes a power greater than the individual. No single person can create a tradition, so it provides justification for believing that this rhythm, and by extension, DrummerX, is elevated above the other people. And that's the exclusionary dogma I would like to avoid.>

when I was first acquainted with traditional rhythms, my first reaction was "well, it sounds like the term 'traditional' meant that a long time ago people created rhythms. The ones that survived became, seemingly by virtue of their longevity and their uniqueness, traditional." I had been playing jembe for over a year at this point, making it up as I went along. I would later find out that many of the improvisational rhythms I stumbled upon were extremely similar to many african rhythm parts. My question was "why is *my* rhythm any less valid. That traditional rhythm is just like my rhythm only a hell of a lot longer ago - so why is it 'better'?"

Can we say a traditional '96 rhythm? Must we wait 10, 20, 100 years for the rhythm to age, thereby proving its worth. Is there such a thing as Rhythmic Darwinism?

So, depending on what side of polyhedron you prefer in this discussion, one school of thought might argue that there can be no new traditional rhythms ('new traditional' - nice oxymoron, eh?). They have all been created; there will be no more.

I remember something Michael Wall wrote a little while ago that discussed naming our own rhythms. Maybe the ones we as a drum community remember and are still playing in 20 years, we can call traditional American rhythms, or traditional Australian rhythms or traditional Canadian rhythms. We would reach a point of developing drum-dialects, much like in Africa or South America. Would Canadian rhythms have that 'eh' thing goin' on at the end of every rhythmic phrase?

We are the vanguard of something that will exist for a very long time. I am not the first to acknowledge that this whole drum thing, in America especially, is in its infancy.

Taylor
Holy Goat Percussion, Chicago, IL
Sales of fine hand-crafted African Jembes and Junjuns
Instrument repairs
Workshops
Drum with the wise and you will become wise
***************************************

Sat Nov 9 15:43:32 1996
From: Nowick Gray nowick@awinc.com
Subject: Re: Rhythmic Darwinism

Taylor wrote:
>The ones that survived became, seemingly by virtue of their longevity and their uniqueness, traditional." I had been playing jembe for over a year at this point making it up as I went along. I would later find out that many of the improvisational rhythms I stumbled upon were extremely similar to many african rhythm parts. My question was "why is *my* rhythm any less valid. That traditional rhythm is just like my rhythm only a hell of a lot longer ago - so why is it 'better'?">

A thoughtful and thought-provoking post re. the past and future of drumming/rhythms. My experience resonates with this, in terms of tapping into the seemingly ready-made pool of pleasing rhythms, as if into the collective unconscious. In answer to the above question, I'm most impressed not so much with the uniqueness of individual traditional rhythms, but with the time-tested genius of the polyrhythmic/polymetric ensemble arrangements. With the beats interlocking at just the right intervals to induce trance and dance effectively. It's easy to reinvent the wheel but not as easy to invent the well-tooled engine or transmission or rear-end differential. Which is not to say impossible. Witness the gifted composers like Doudou Rose, or the gifts of inspired group improvisation.

-- Nowick Gray
nowick@awinc.com
Cougar WebWorks
http://www.he.net/~cougarww/
**************************************

To start a new thread, I would like to ask a question concerning the origin of the djembe. One story I have heard is that the djembe did not come into popular use until about 50 years ago. Before that, it was strictly used in ritual and only in religious ceremonies. Maybe that's the origin for the djembes that are sanctified with herbs and all kinds of charms, that supposedly contain a spirit. According to Fred Simpson in one of his workshops, you don't want to own one of those; unless you are ready to handle the power of the spirit in that drum.

Tue Oct 8 12:39:25 1996
From: Lynn Walsh lwalsh@interactive.wsj.co
Subject: origin of the djembe

To Paul Czerner and List pczerner@ivid.com
>To start a new thread, I would like to ask a question concerning the >origin of the djembe... [snip/MTF]
>
O.K., I'll bite... here's my contribution (with a artistic embellishments). My master teacher Madou Dembele from Mali/Guinea (also plays with Baba "O" in New York area venues and teaches there) gave me this origin-legend.

Originally God made woman and put her in paradise. Later when God checked on his creation he asked the Woman "Is there anything that I can provide to make your life even more perfect?" She replied that she would like a drum. That drum is the Djembe drum. She mastered all the songs, sounds and rhythms of the universe and put spirit into ALL Djembe drums. So Woman was the original benefactor of this divine gift. I feel/know intuit that all Djembe drums have spirit(s). Like any thing else which you have an intimate relationship with, things you treasure, decorate, create with, share, pray with.... our drums are sanctified. Ju Ju, magical herbs, crystals, chanting, ceremonial blessings; if done with positive intention and a clean heart enhance the power of the drum and the player as each travel into the spirit world together and with mutual respect. Let the original Woman reveal her unsung secrets to you and bless you on your journey. P.S. Don't buy any "ju ju objects" unless you know its origin, purpose, better to make your own.

Lynn Walsh
Wall Street Journal Interactive Edition
(212)416-3526 fx (212)416-3548
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Fri Oct 11 22:50:39 1996
From: terrapin@cats.ucsc.edu (Beth Dyer)
Subject: Re: Drum Spirit

> I'd like to open up the floor to anyone who knows how spirit is traditionally involved in the use of the djembe, and also to anyone that has actually had experiences of the spirit of the drum, enough to change their perspective on things. Anyone?>

I'll address the latter part of the question here. For 13 years of my life, I battled eating disorders (anorexia nervosa at first, later bulimia). I tried several of the Western solutions to these problems but nothing worked. I'd been playing drums for about 3 or 4 years, including studying with various teachers. I'd worked with Baba Olatunji in particular as often as possible. That summer, I attended the weeklong workshop Baba does at Esalen every July. I left that workshop with no symptoms! And, miraculously, they never reappeared!

Any of you who have had problems with addictive/compulsive illnesses know that it's phenomenal to overcome such a problem. Usually, the pattern is so strong that it beckons to you for quite some time. I never experienced this. While I can't say that drumming is everyone's answer to eating disorders, I will say that there's a lot to be said for following one's bliss and for the healing power of drums.

I cannot point to one moment during that week where everything became different. That's ok; I know that the vibration of the drum healed me. This sounds a bit like a revival-meetin' testimonial, huh? I didn't intend it that way... just sharing my experience.

******************************** Sun Nov 3 08:45:45 1996
From: drumpath@aztec.asu.edu (SULE GREGORY C. WILSON)
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

Hi; remember, when you invoke--don't do it for yourself.
When you invoke--don't do it 'cause it's the thing to be done.
Remember you are standing on your own ancestors, and those in the ground with you.
Remember that when you call, an answer will come, whether its one you want to hear or not.
Wisdom comes from deep.
Before you be who you're gonna be, carry who you've been, before you, with open eyes and heart.

Mon Nov 4 07:31:37 1996
From: jmillen@abs.net (John Millen)
Subject: Re: Tradition and American continent

Hi everyone, today Sule wrote:
>remember, when you invoke--don't do it for yourself.
>When you invoke--don't do it 'cause it's the thing to be done.
>Remember you are standing on your own ancestors, and those in the ground with you.
>Remember that when you call, an answer will come, whether its one you want to hear or not.
>Wisdom comes from deep.
>Before you be who you're gonna be, carry who you've been, before you, with open eyes and heart.
>
>Sule the Green-Eyed Drum Guy

As the Quakers say (not being one myself) that Friend speaks my mind! and it is hard, hard work. We have been ignoring our ancestors in the ground and the spirits of our unborn children for a long time now. We have all but lost the language needed for a relationship with the spirit world. The call of the drum is imho (for us in the *developed* West) the longing for this vital link. Some time ago I had a dream in which I was seated in a chair and with my hand I reached down for my Djembe to my right side while my eyes were focused in front of me. It was as if my hand penetrated a different world that was right there at my feet and yet invisible to me. And as my hand entered this world, I heard the voice of a black man. "Careful" he said gently, but firmly and without reproach, "I'm down here too".

Go slow, my friends and don't try to do too much, and as Sule the wise green-eyed drum guy says, be careful what you evoke!

John Millen ThunderHeart@pobox.com
ThunderHeart Drums
http://pobox.com/~thunderheart/
Baltimore MD
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In a message dated 96-11-04 18:19:00 EST, you write:
> Bark,
>
> I don't even know the name of any rhythm that I play, but I love love love
> to play Drum! I play for hours just by myself or with anyone that love to
> play.
> > We missed you at Washington Drum Circle!
>
> Drumming all or any rhythm,
> > Jairo
Jairo,
It must be great living in Brazil where the rhythms are naturally such a part of you and indicative of your rich culture. We, speaking in general about most American Drummers, drumming folkloric rhythms from other continents. Have a "need to know" if you know what I mean? Somewhere down the line the roots we plant here now in the U.S will be felt by the "next generation" of American Drummers. I speak of the "next generation" a lot. I believe strongly in taking the drums to children. Teaching what we all, on this list, know already. Drumming is fun.

The communications between the members of this list, the conferences, the gatherings are all groundwork for the "next generation" here in the U.S

My partner in music is an American who grew up in Brazil. He has explained to me many times the feeling you gave us in your post about your drumming.

Thu Nov 7 16:01:02 1996
Subject: Re: Where was music invented?
From: matt.burroughs@juno.com (Matt A Csuka)

Once upon a time, in a galaxy all your own, there was a tree deep in the middle of a jungle. Every once and a while this tree would see apes running around and felt that they were obviously stupid- at the very moment he thought that thought, mother nature appeared to him in a long flowing robe adorned with leaves carved from the finest emeralds and dew drops on her eye lashes made of diamonds. She asked this fine tree if he wanted to take part in an experiment that would probably hurt, but would be for the good of everything. He took many a minute considering her proposition and came to the realization the he would eventually die never having taken part in anything remotely fun aside from being a tree.

At the very moment he was done considering his options, his roots began to give way and tiny ants (which were also hired by mother nature) started to gut him. For some reason he felt little pain, it was more of a tickle than anything else. Before our great tree knew exactly what was happening, he saw several of the monkeys he had seen earlier running at him with little care, for if they were being cautious, the largest monkey wouldn't have tripped over our fair tree's hollow body- creating two loud and finely pitched thuds, resembling the lowest djembe note possible in a hollow tree. All the monkeys stopped, scratched their heads, walked back over to the tree and slapped its bark fearfully. Night after night they repeated the process, from this they began to dance and soon found themselves completely bald and able to speak by mimicking the trees sounds. Soon that wasn't good enough for them though. They carved the tree into a funny cup shape and learned to manipulate the pitch by stretching their loin clothes over one end. In seeing this, mother nature was pleased. By way of coercing a tree (whose hollow tone lives on in all instruments) she had created music, and also, because they could manipulate the rhythms they produced, HUMANS.

Keep this in mind then go plant a tree, sit under it and play your drum, I'm sure mother nature didn't intend to let humans get as out of control as they did. So, lend a hand and save our natural resources, free the trees in Brazil, do anything to give mother nature a hand- lord knows we owe her big.

On Tradition & Culture M3

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On Tradition & Culture
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